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#3514: "Divine Chalice and summoning gauge"

confirmed: Buggen är bekräftad av utvecklarna

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Seasons #15641827

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#	Status	Votes	Game	Type	Title	Last update

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16 Aug 2015 11:46 • demiurgsage • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

I played Divine Chalice and saw that I had no free space for summoning card. I tried to use "+1 summoning gauge" bonus to add free space, but it caused error.
I think that the game should produce a warning when player whose summoning gauge insufficient try to play Divine Chalice. Also I think that the game should allow to use "+1" bonus during playing this card.

26 Feb 2016 22:09 • thoughtography • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

I agree with the statement that the Divine Chalice should warn when played if the summoning gauge is insufficient. I have played this card twice without noticing the insufficient gauge until it is too late and lost my 4 energy along with basically losing the power card selecting.

8 Sep 2017 12:06 • ollyfish2002 • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

same for me in this game
Seasons #33313726

28 Apr 2020 06:42 • Kelrek • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

We also saw this issue in our game. Table #80371851. One person summoned his Divine Chalice and then noticed that he did not have a summoning space available for the additional card to be played. He had to choose the new card, but then that card just disappeared.
A warning before playing in this situation would be very nice.

28 Apr 2020 11:51 • diamant • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

rule, page 10 (Divine Chalice):
"You must have a summoning gauge high enough to be able to put into play the card drawn. Otherwise, discard it."

The implementation complies with the rule.

The divine Chalice can thus always be summoned when the summoning gauge allows its summoning, but not that of an additional power card.

It is up to each player to predict the consequences of his actions and whether it is in his interest to increase his summoning gauge beforehand, if such an increase is possible.

Not a bug.

7 Jun 2020 05:03 • thankyoumrdata • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

The same thing just happened to me, costing me the game.

I strongly disagree with diamant's interpretation. If you were playing with humans, you would simply activate the bonus and give yourself an extra summoning gauge. Here you can click in the wrong order -- once you summon Divine Chalice, you "paint yourself into a corner" that ruins the game for you.

It does not behoove each player to predict that the implemetation of the game will mess them up because they didn't know they couldn't use a bonus in the middle of the card effect resolving.

Leaving it like this makes the game less fun, and fixing it makes the game more fun. It is a bug in the sense that it makes the game less playable and increases the number of games that end with a frustrated player, to literally no good end.

27 Mar 2021 06:17 • minisplat • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

Agreed. While it's true that the rulebook warns the player that their summoning gauge must be high enough, that isn't always immediately obvious when playing online. I think a warning of some sort (such as Warning: Your summoning gauge is not high enough to play an additional card.") would be helpful to many players.
My opponent did this on accident today because he was on mobile and didn't track that he was short a slot.

29 May 2021 22:52 • jrr • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

I think introducing a warning message just for this one interaction opens up a whole can of worms, as there are plenty of other easy mistakes a player can make in this game that would also merit similar warnings. I'd say the other existing suggestion of adding an undo button would be the better solution.

That said, the suggestion of being able to use a bonus before choosing what card Chalice puts into play is an interesting one. Looking at the rules, it's not clear to me if players are allowed to use bonuses in the midst of resolving a card's effects.

Regarding playing cards, the rules say:
"The type of effect of the power cards determine at what time the effect of the card which has just been summoned must be resolved. There are three different options
-The “when entering play” effects: the card’s effect trigger only when the card has just been summoned."

If anything, I could see it argued that "*must* be resolved" "when the card has just been summoned" means you can't do anything else until that card is resolved (unless there is another card in play with an overriding effect), and therefore you can't use a bonus at that point.

31 May 2021 01:56 • Elea K • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

Same thing happened to me. Wish I could have used the bonus or was given a warning before summoning it.

It would have also been nice to allow the card to be added to one's hand by using a prompt "keep in hand" or "discard." I missed out on having access to the card that was summoned. I would have rather paid for it than have it disappear entirely.

7 Mar 2022 06:09 • kirby9066 • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

This bug still exists and should be fixed.

7 Mar 2022 13:58 • diamant • Buggen har inte kunnat återupprepas av utvecklarna än:

@thankyoumrdata: When you play games with humans, it can be either for a friendly game, or as part of a tournament.So you can’t pretend that gross mistakes are always forgiven, since the goal of a tournament is either to eliminate the weak players, or to ensure the best fit of game levels for future games.

Of course, I am not opposed to the principle of an option for beginners to avoid frequent mistakes, as was done for Ralllyman GT. Except that, unlike Rallyman GT, Seasons rules are very incorrectly implemented on critical issues, such as end-of-turn effects.
I therefore hope that future developments will be devoted to the correct consideration of the fundamental elements of the game and the effects of cards, and not to trivialities.
I also note that the rule specifies that the use of a bonus is an action, and therefore that a priori (there is no indication to the contrary in the rules or FAQ), a bonus cannot be used while another action is in progress.

12 Aug 2022 12:12 • JeroenDemeyer • Buggen är bekräftad av utvecklarna:

Hard to say what we should do here. We *do* have a confirmation dialog for using a bonus, so there is at least some precedent. I don't think it would hurt to add it for Divine Chalice, although that opens a potentially slippery slope where people will want dialogs for everything.

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#3514: "Divine Chalice and summoning gauge"

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